Official Social Network of The Theosophical Society in America
The Spirit of this Theosophical Community
I think when we engage in an activity we should have in mind the purpose of it, so I want to share some thoughts about our Theosophical Community.
An online theosophical activity can have different aims. It can be a place to establish social contacts and foster a sense of community. It can be a space to introduce people to Theosophical literature, or to deepen the understanding of Theosophy. It can also be an arena to discuss controversial historical issues, or to examine the working of the Theosophical Society (TS), or to denounce things we think are not being done right, etc. Each activity will tend to attract and engage certain kinds of people and discourage others.
Personally speaking, I think our online community should be focused on the introduction to Theosophical teachings and deepening our understanding, leaving aside the discussion of controversial issues--current or historical--about the TS or theosophical leaders. Let me explain the reasons for this proposal.
The Theosophical Community is a visible, public face of the TS. If we aspire to engage new members and people interested in knowing what Theosophy is, giving predominance to controversial issues is surely not the way to show what Theosophy is.
If new people or members, with no experience in the TS, come to our community and see that controversial issues, denouncements, ill will, etc., occupy a considerable space in our discussions, what will they think about the TS? Let’s suppose you are interested in a philosophy you know nothing about, let us say, Buddhism. You encounter an online “Buddhist Community” and all you see is fellow Buddhists cutting each other’s throat in the name of their love for Buddhism and the sanga; what would you do? Would you be willing to join that sanga? Would you believe their “words of wisdom”?
Am I proposing to show a fake image to the public? Not at all! On the contrary, we are now showing a false image. In our daily theosophical life (the real one, not the online life) controversial issues are usually not a prominent part of our theosophical activity. We spend our time in the study of Theosophy and the attempt to practice it. The fact that our institution is right now going through a stormy time may cover up this reality, but this also shall pass and we will come back to a renewed time of unity, as has happened so many times in the past.
Besides, from an esoteric point of view, I’m sure these discussions become a source of dreadful elementals. We know that everything we think or feel produces a kind of artificial elemental. As one of the Mahatmas wrote to Mr. Hume in his first letter:
“We see a vast difference between the qualities of two equal amounts of energy expended by two men, of whom one, let us suppose, is on his way to his daily quiet work, and another on his way to denounce a fellow creature at the police station, while the men of science see none (...) And why? Because every thought of man upon being evolved passes into the inner world and becomes an active entity by associating itself—coalescing, we might term it—with an elemental; that is to say with one of the semi-intelligent forces of the kingdoms. It survives as an active intelligence, a creature of the mind's begetting, for a longer or shorter period proportionate with the original intensity of the cerebral action which generated it. Thus, a good thought is perpetuated as an active beneficent power; an evil one as a maleficent demon. And so man is continually peopling his current in space with a world of his own, crowded with the offsprings of his fancies, desires, impulses, and passions, a current which reacts upon any sensitive or and nervous organisation which comes in contact with it in proportion to its dynamic intensity. The Buddhist calls this his "Skandha," the Hindu gives it the name of "Karma"; the Adept evolves these shapes consciously, other men throw them off unconsciously.”
When we are discussing controversial issues, or people read those discussions, what are we thinking about? What do we feel? Do we feel love, compassion, inspiration, unity, etc.? What kind of feelings and thoughts are we replicating?
Usually, the online discussion of controversial issues becomes an arena to gossip, lie, and state half-truths, thus fostering conflict, ill-feelings, separateness, and finally deepening differences and keeping them alive. And worst of all, this is not even useful, because this kind of issue cannot be solved through an online discussion.
So, since there are already other online forums where people can discuss all these controversial issues, like the theos-talk, I propose we should redirect the activity of this community and exclude controversial and institutional issues. If people are interested they can join the already existent forums. I don’t think it is necessary to replicate that activity here. Or, as a less drastic alternative, we could start another online community specifically focused on institutional/historic issues (as Chris Richardson did with his blog) for those who feel necessary to have that space.
What do you all think?
An online theosophical activity can have different aims. It can be a place to establish social contacts and foster a sense of community. It can be a space to introduce people to Theosophical literature, or to deepen the understanding of Theosophy. It can also be an arena to discuss controversial historical issues, or to examine the working of the Theosophical Society (TS), or to denounce things we think are not being done right, etc. Each activity will tend to attract and engage certain kinds of people and discourage others.
Personally speaking, I think our online community should be focused on the introduction to Theosophical teachings and deepening our understanding, leaving aside the discussion of controversial issues--current or historical--about the TS or theosophical leaders. Let me explain the reasons for this proposal.
The Theosophical Community is a visible, public face of the TS. If we aspire to engage new members and people interested in knowing what Theosophy is, giving predominance to controversial issues is surely not the way to show what Theosophy is.
If new people or members, with no experience in the TS, come to our community and see that controversial issues, denouncements, ill will, etc., occupy a considerable space in our discussions, what will they think about the TS? Let’s suppose you are interested in a philosophy you know nothing about, let us say, Buddhism. You encounter an online “Buddhist Community” and all you see is fellow Buddhists cutting each other’s throat in the name of their love for Buddhism and the sanga; what would you do? Would you be willing to join that sanga? Would you believe their “words of wisdom”?
Am I proposing to show a fake image to the public? Not at all! On the contrary, we are now showing a false image. In our daily theosophical life (the real one, not the online life) controversial issues are usually not a prominent part of our theosophical activity. We spend our time in the study of Theosophy and the attempt to practice it. The fact that our institution is right now going through a stormy time may cover up this reality, but this also shall pass and we will come back to a renewed time of unity, as has happened so many times in the past.
Besides, from an esoteric point of view, I’m sure these discussions become a source of dreadful elementals. We know that everything we think or feel produces a kind of artificial elemental. As one of the Mahatmas wrote to Mr. Hume in his first letter:
“We see a vast difference between the qualities of two equal amounts of energy expended by two men, of whom one, let us suppose, is on his way to his daily quiet work, and another on his way to denounce a fellow creature at the police station, while the men of science see none (...) And why? Because every thought of man upon being evolved passes into the inner world and becomes an active entity by associating itself—coalescing, we might term it—with an elemental; that is to say with one of the semi-intelligent forces of the kingdoms. It survives as an active intelligence, a creature of the mind's begetting, for a longer or shorter period proportionate with the original intensity of the cerebral action which generated it. Thus, a good thought is perpetuated as an active beneficent power; an evil one as a maleficent demon. And so man is continually peopling his current in space with a world of his own, crowded with the offsprings of his fancies, desires, impulses, and passions, a current which reacts upon any sensitive or and nervous organisation which comes in contact with it in proportion to its dynamic intensity. The Buddhist calls this his "Skandha," the Hindu gives it the name of "Karma"; the Adept evolves these shapes consciously, other men throw them off unconsciously.”
When we are discussing controversial issues, or people read those discussions, what are we thinking about? What do we feel? Do we feel love, compassion, inspiration, unity, etc.? What kind of feelings and thoughts are we replicating?
Usually, the online discussion of controversial issues becomes an arena to gossip, lie, and state half-truths, thus fostering conflict, ill-feelings, separateness, and finally deepening differences and keeping them alive. And worst of all, this is not even useful, because this kind of issue cannot be solved through an online discussion.
So, since there are already other online forums where people can discuss all these controversial issues, like the theos-talk, I propose we should redirect the activity of this community and exclude controversial and institutional issues. If people are interested they can join the already existent forums. I don’t think it is necessary to replicate that activity here. Or, as a less drastic alternative, we could start another online community specifically focused on institutional/historic issues (as Chris Richardson did with his blog) for those who feel necessary to have that space.
What do you all think?
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Alex Morgan on -
Very true, theos-talk came to mind soon as I started reading this :)
The elementals here should be dispelled, I agree.
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Permalink Reply by Konstantin Zaitzev on -
We came upon the same problem on our Russian forum. We still haven't solved it but there were the good proposals.
From the one side, we cannot supress the freedom of speech, from the other side, reading this, the newcomers get bad impression about theosophy and especially theosophists. The proposal was that 1) such discussions should be permitted only in a special section which is not seen by guests but by the registered users only, and 2) messages of this section shouldn't be displayed among the updates on the title page.
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Permalink Reply by William Vollrath on -
I am fine with an attempt to limit discussions on this site to issues of Theosophy outside of the political and organizational issues of the local, national and international groups, but suspect it is unrealistic to believe even that, if it is being energetically utilized, will not generate some disagreements and bruised egos. It is the nature of our growth and humanity...
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Permalink Reply by Konstantin Zaitzev on
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I would like to permit the organizational discussions about the optimization of the work of the Society. (Organization of meetings and congresses, collecting fees, publishing work, etc).
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Permalink Reply by Toni Saghbiny on -
Hello,
I totally agree. I'll just say my modest opinion as a newcomer
I live in a country where there are no T.S lodges or even T.S members, so my only source of study and information is currently the internet, also my interaction with other theosophists is online only. Although someone can never judge an organization from online discussions, I can say that what is presented online have definitely a fair amount of influence on the image of T.S, especially for those who can't see T.S (society or members) except through their laptop screen.
After reading a couple of downloaded books on Theosophy, I started to follow up theosophist blogs and discussions, and it was the election period where discussions were spread like wildfire (no offense guys really :)
The good thing about this experience was that I had a good view of what's really happening in the society which I decided to join, so when I made the decision I made it knowing that there was a bigger responsibility in the hands of every T.S member.
But the cons were bigger. The whole issue delayed me somehow in making official steps toward becoming a member, and I think that the fact that studying esoteric teachings for many years and the past organizational experiences have saved me somehow from being spooked away by this kind of troubles.
So I always think that maybe for a lot of other people, this could really have a negative effect, especially toward their perception of T.S. And maybe it drives people away, not only from T.S but also from studying Theosophy.
I'm not saying you should ban these kind of discussions online (and the fact that they exist means that there's a certain need for discussion) but I think organizational issues should be for "members only", because when it's visual to everybody, it somehow drives away the attention from studying Theosophy principles to organizational non-related to study debate.
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Permalink Reply by Janeth on -
>"So I always think that maybe for a lot of other people, this could really have a negative effect, especially toward their perception of T.S. And maybe it drives people away, not only from T.S but also from studying Theosophy."---Exactly, Toni!!
This from a new member says a lot! Thank you so very much for sharing your sentiments with us!! As to "I live in a country where there are no T.S lodges or even T.S members", I believe every TS study group world-wide has been formed thanks to human beings with a sound mind, soft heart and altruistic soul who dared, endured, persevere and triumphed !!☺ "If you build it, they will come"--Unless I am mistaken, these are the words we hear in the movie "Field of Dreams", with Kevin Costner.
This brings to mind the real story of a man, student of occult sciences, who dreamt of having a study group to share his knowledge and ideas with. He would sit down in an empty room, always at the same time and date and give his lectures. One day, someone asked him, there is no-one here, who are you talking to? The occultist smiled and said, "I am creating an archetype of what I want my group to be like"-☺
His group was one of the most successful ones in South America. His teachings live on in the minds and hearts of those who were privileged enough to cross his Path!! I was very little and didn't understand then what they were talking about but the beautiful spiritual, mental and emotional energy has stayed with me since then-☺
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Permalink Reply by Anton Rozman on -
Dear friends,
Let us remind why discussions on controversial issues or constitutional problems are actually going on. The main reason is, as stated also by John Algeo and Betty Bland and several others high officers of the TS, dysfunctional General Council, problematic management of the Administration at the TS Headquarters, lack of transparency and accountability. These are serious problems and the TS needs an international forum to address them. Unfortunately we don’t have it yet. The TSA Theosophical Community therefore appeared as a hope that it will represent a place where also this kind of issues could be discussed in a serious, rational and analytical manner, in a different way than on some e-mail lists.
It seems that current proposal represents the recognition that we are not capable to address these problems in an adequate manner, that we don’t possess abilities to interact positively and collaboratively, so that we must remove them from public eye.
I am quite sure that public image of the TS will not improve with such decision. On the contrary, I am more than convinced that the TS could acquire substantial credibility in the public eye if it would be able to prove that it is capable to properly address and solve these important questions, to prove that it is capable to practically apply its philosophy and principles.
Warmest regards,
Anton
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Permalink Reply by William Vollrath on
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Anton is probably correct on this...
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Permalink Reply by Konstantin Zaitzev on
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> These are serious problems and the TS needs an international forum to address them.
Probably it would be nice to discuss this problem on the next world congress, as it has wider and more balanced representation than annual convention has.
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Permalink Reply by Janeth on
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>"a place where also this kind of issues could be discussed in a serious, rational and analytical manner"<---AMEN to this, Anton!!☺ I agree with you dear Anton; however, if we truly love and care about Theosophy and TS, we should try to do so in a way that it does not discourage new minds interested in Theosophy. With the technology we have available today there are ways to accomplish this....
The question is....
What is more important individuals personal ego and personal interests/agenda or Theosophy and its vehicle, The-TS?
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Permalink Reply by Janeth on
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>"I am quite sure that public image of the TS will not improve with such decision."<---I am quite sure it will!!
I am positive public image of the Society will dramatically improve should bright ideas such as the ones Konstantin shared with us (above) be implemented.--"1) such discussions should be permitted only in a special section which is not seen by guests but by the registered users only, and 2) messages of this section shouldn't be displayed among the updates on the title page."
This requires great humility and intelligence, wisdom and compassion/divine love, unselfishness and altruism-(TS cornerstone), will and determination to do what's right by the Society, its leaders, and its members, open mindedness and eagerness to serve others just for the joy of doing so...Unfortunately, evidence has and is showing us, this is very much lacking today...Some times I wonder...Are most Theosophists smart enough to learn from others' experiences? Recently, I can't help thinking a lot about what Manly P. Hall said, so long ago, in his introduction to "Blavatsky and The Secret Doctrine"-How The Secret Doctrine was written. The plan upon which it was constructed. A summary of the teachings it contains-written by Max Heindel, for those who have not come across this yet, here it is:
"Nearly all students of the occult sciences in America know the work which Madame Blavatsky and Max Heindel have accomplished. The lives of these two religious founders are a constant challenge to greater spiritual effort and more unselfish devotion. If we admire these great leaders we shall desire to further their work by the intelligent perpetuation of their doctrines through word and action. During the period of the great World War metaphysics lost a great opportunity to make a permanent contribution to the race by allowing itself to be broken up by internal disruptions and controversies. Organizations which should have been dedicated to the unselfish service of mankind instead wasted their energy in vain wranglings over personal issues of little if any importance.
Suppose this very day H. P. Blavatsky, the lioness of the Theosophical Society, should return from the Amenti of the wise, and should demand an accounting from the members of the society she founded. Who could stand before her and say honestly, "Beloved teacher, we have done our best, we have remained true to you and the Masters for whom you spoke." How many could say, "We have been honest, kind, just and impersonal; we have hewed true to the wisdom you gave us; we have spread your message; we have read your books; most of all we have remained absolutely free, as you bade us, from all disastrous entanglements and alliances." How many could say, "Here is your Society as clean as when you gave it to us." Could Theosophists do this or would they become abashed and unable to gaze into the great sad, luminous eyes of the first and greatest Theosophist? Could Madame Blavatsky walk through the corridors of Adyar and turn to those who represent her in the twentieth century and say, "Well done, good and faithful servants? If she could not say this, why not? Is it because they have remembered her name and forgotten her work? Is it because weak, petty men and women have so forgotten the greater good that they have elevated themselves to power upon the wreakage of ideals? Theosophists of the world, rededicate yourselves to the noblest spirit that was among you, whose labors are your wealth, whose ideals are your purpose, and whose unselfish sacrifice is the cornerstone of your organization.” -Blavatsky and "The Secret Doctrine" by Max Heindel - Pages 14-17 - First Edition 1933 - Third Printing, 1979 - ISBN: 0-87516-163-4
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Permalink Reply by Janeth on
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>"If new people or members, with no experience in the TS, come to our community and see that controversial issues, denouncements, ill will, etc., occupy a considerable space in our discussions, what will they think about the TS?"<---EXACTLY!! Thus one of the main reasons behind my idea of having Anand's forum set up in a way that new comers’, especially those who are not familiar with Theosophy, do not get a wrong first impression of Theosophy and its vehcle, The-TS and what each stands for.
Thank you very much for posting this forum, Pablo!!☺ Thank you also for the great volunteering job you and your wife, Juliana, performed on behalf of Theosophy, The-TSA and The-TS!!☺ I am sure your spiritual brothers and sisters back home are very happy to have you back!!☺ So long, dear spiritual brother!!☺
Best,
J.
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