The Esoteric School Lobby

[Anand Gholap]

(Annie Besant was the head of the Esoteric School and Colonel Olcott was the President of TS.)
Mrs. Annie Besant wrote:
“In the T.S. we have a curious mixture. The Exoteric Society is purely democratic - it is only fair to admit this fully. On the other side we have an Esoteric body which is practically autocratic in its constitution ... The existence of a secret body to rule the outer Society made the constitution of the T.S. a mere farce, for it was at the mercy of the inner … All the differences that arose between the Colonel and myself were on this point; he could not believe that I was serious in saying that I would not use the E.S. against him, but slowly he came to understand it ... The greatest power will always be in the hands of the E.S., and not in the head of the Society ... I know that I exercise a quite unwarrantable power. This is what makes some people say there should not be an E.S.T. … We must recognize the danger and try to neutralize it. At any time during the last fifteen years I could have checkmated the Colonel on any point if I had chosen ...”

I could see frustration of some officers in TS regarding the results in Presidential elections. They were wondering how one person can get elected unopposed for around 30 years. It happened again and again in TS history. Different theories were offered to explain this phenomenon. I think all that mystery is solved by above passages of Annie Besant.
Best
Anand Gholap

[William Vollrath]

It would be helpful if someone from TSA now responded to the Robert Bruce comments Anand posted on the expulsion of TS Canada in the 1990's. I find them very disturbing, if true, since many of the same people are still in control!

[Anton Rozman]

Dear Janeth,

Sometimes it seems to me that you in America have a rule: "Shoot first, then ask!", while here we like to apply: "Count: one, two, three, then jump!" :-)

With web page I mean a page similar to those linked to before and on which relevant discussions will be republished. It will take some time.

Warmest regards,
Anton

[Janeth]

Reply by Anand Gholap 45 minutes ago

>"Here are precise words of Annie Besant "The existence of a secret body to rule the outer Society made the constitution of the T.S. a mere farce"<---Precise words? According to whom? Do you have an authenticated handwritten document signed by Dr. Besant? he answer is NO! How are we to know with certainty those are her, as you put it, "precise words"? Because they appear in a book? As advanced in occult sciences as Dr. Besant was, to assume those words were uttered by her is pretty much unwise!!

It is accurate to say, such and such is what so and so heard from so and so who said Dr. Besant said.

[Janeth]

Dear Anton,

Please do not generalise; you in America?

And whatever it is you mean in your first paragraph, what is important to note is that, I do not play ball/politics. If my directness is too much for your sensitivity, that is your personal challenge to deal with, no-one else's challenge but yours alone.

All was needed from you was: It will be a regular Web-site as the others I have linked.

Interesting getting to know you better!☺

Best,
J.

[Janeth]

There is no "Reply to This" option at the end of your comment, Konstantin, so I am posting it at the end of the thread.

Re: Reply by Konstantin Zaitzev 1 day ago
The problem is "us" imperfect human beings and how we interpret the teachings..
>”There's a problem with a system which is…>ES would work only if its head were much more advanced than most of us. If not, with other conditions of karma which you wrote about being provided, it becomes a playground of forces where members' karma is just "being burned".<---Dear Konstantin, I have had your intelligent and perceptive comment in the back of my mind since the moment I read it…It is just now that I am able to reply to it, sorry it took me so long-☺
First, please allow me to say…I am very, very sorry for the pain and frustration you have had to endure because of others’ ignorance. If you would please be so kind and generous as to allow me to ask for your forgiveness for any and all transgressions you have been put through because of “small minded people”!! Will you please find it in your heart to forgive them and with that forgive us all?...Please?-☺..After all.., we are part of ONE, are we not?☺ I have been listening to Mrs. Bland’s NDE CD, again, today…I thought of you…I had to write to you today!!☺
Second, I agree with you…I agree with you, not completely, but partially. Let me see if I can explain myself, please-☺.
The TS-ES was established over hundred years ago, right? Yes.
TS-ES was created by highly evolved human beings, right? Yes.
The purpose behind its creation was to help serious and dedicated students of Theosophy advance their spiritual pilgrimage at a faster pace, right? Yes.
Who, in reality, runs TS-ES around the globe? One single imperfect human being? NO!!☺ No, my dear brother, the system and discipline is one and the same for all TS-ES students!!☺ Each TS Section has its own TS-ES head (I sure hope this is the case, as it is the case with our great TSA…Please don’t tell me this is not the case at every other Section..?)
What does this mean?☺ Aha..☺, it means that regardless of whether TS-ES multinational head is or not, borrowing your intelligent words, “much more advanced than most of us”, is of no consequence!!☺ This is why the system is so unique!!☺ There is freedom in it!!!☺ TS-ES members do not have to depend on TS-ES multinational head!!☺
The system is so unique…☺, we, TS members, do not have to depend on TS multinational head to advance on our own spiritual pilgrimage!!☺
Will you please be so kind as to allow me to refer you to Mr. Morrow’s master piece writing I re-posted on this thread…Please read it, dear brother, and once you do it once, and had read it top to bottom, please do not assume you have read everything..☺ Do you know what I mean?☺
With loving thoughts and gratitude for the privilege of meeting you in this life thanks to TSA and its current Nat’l President, and the loving support she receives from the other TSA board of directors, as well as the loving support she receives from the staff she commands, and TSA loyal members around this great country, the USA!!☺ She dares to listen to young faces with brilliant minds, and probably old souls!!-☺..She pays attention to them!!☺ She listened to one of TSA brilliant minds occupying the young physical body of Dan Noga, and what do we have now?☺ We have TC!! Yeaaahhh!! While other non-profit spiritual institutions refuse to allow its members to have a social net-work, TSA’s Nat’l President, Mrs. Bland, dared to say YES!! Thanks to all of these beautiful human beings we have privileges others did not even dream of hundred years ago!!☺ Have I told you I love Theosophy, TSA, TS and TC?!!☺ Ha, ha, ha, just being a bit silly-☺. I don’t mind being silly some times, especially when I am talking to beautiful hearts and brilliant minds, and courageous souls like yours, dear Konstantin!!☺ Namaste, dear brother!!☺ Be well!!☺ That is an order! Ha, ha, ha..Be happy and do please continue enlightening our minds and hearts with your intelligent and perceptive contributions and witty common sense!!☺

[Anand Gholap]

In TS, General Council is supposed to be the most powerful decision making body,
just as Congress is in the US government. But as most General Council members
are also members of ES, whose head is TS President, and as these General Council
members perhaps think that it is their duty to obey "without cavil and delay"
orders of the Outer Head, they don't challenge President's decisions. This is
the impression members are getting.
So, when you have an ES, you make constitution of TS ineffective because there
remain no checks and balances in TS.
If a General Council member, who is pledged member of ES, challenges the
President, he breaks the convention of obeying commands of the Outer Head. And
if he does not question decisions of the President, he is doing injustice to his
post as elected representative of TS members.
That is why ES and TS constitutions are not compatible with each other, unless
heads of two are different. Even when heads are different, there should not form
a lobby, if the spirit of constitution is to be protected.
When there is no ES, TS constitution has highest checks and balances.
Best
Anand Gholap

[Anand Gholap]

There are also some other factors that make President too powerful. At present,
President can withdraw charter of any Section, Federation or lodge. Because of
it, President can tell officers of a Section "Do what I say, or I will remove
charter of your Section". Because of this threat, officers in national sections
fear to challenge the President on any issue.
The power to remove charter of any Section, federation or lodge must be given to
only General Council. If charter of any section or federation or lodge is to be
removed, it should require majority votes from the General Council, taken in
secrete ballot.

[William Vollrath]

Anand, I could not agree more on the importance of checks and balances on the power to remove a Section's charter. I am shocked to hear one individual can do so...

[Janeth]

>"There are also some other factors that make President too powerful. At present,
President can withdraw charter of any Section, Federation or lodge. Because of
it, President can tell officers of a Section "Do what I say, or I will remove
charter of your Section""<---I would say...This is a big problem!! One single individual making such a drastic decision? Perhaps something about this can be done now that GC members are working on modifications to be made to TS by-laws?

Are you, TS members world wide, keeping your Section leaders, those who are doing the right thing by Theosophy and its vehicle, the TS, informed?

With the current autocratic TS system I would suggest to TS members around the world...
♥ Please appreciate what you have!!
♥ Please protect and support your Section leaders!!
♥ Do your best to keep in mind the basics of Theosophy!!
♥ Think like Theosophists!!
♥ Talk like Theosophists!!
♥ Behave like Theosophists!!
Lest your Section be dismantled just because.

[Janeth]

>"But as most General Council members are also members of ES,...<---Let us think of this from a different perspective, please.

a) According to ancient/archaic TS by-laws, its president is allowed to select 12..., allow me to say this again, please...12 (twelve) GC members la on his/her own.

b) How many TS Sections do we have? 25, give and take.

c) What is the formula used to determine how many GC members a Section is allowed to have?
Will some one be so kind as to give us that formula, please?☺

d) The TS annual GC meeting is held during the most important religious celebration in the world. December 25.

e) After all the sacrifices non-Adyar GC members make during the year, is it fair to ask them to sacrifice being with their families during such an important occasion?

f) Are all non-Adyar GC members able to travel every year to Adyar every December, leaving their families and love ones behind? I do not think so.

g) So what do we have? A disproportionate and impractical GC!!

h) Can it be fixed? Yes.

i) Will it get fix? Yes.

j) When? It would be nice to see TS President, Dr. Burnier, fixing it.

k) Will Dr. Burnier do it? I doubt it.

m) Why do you doubt it, Janeth? It is not in Dr. Burnier's (I mean, if she is in fact the head, heart and soul running TS), interests/agenda. And it is not in her allies GC members' interests/agenda, either. I mean really she has 12 GC members that, either, she controls, or they control her. I have no difficulty imagining those 12 GC members are always present or represented at annual GC meetings. I also have no difficulty believing whoever her 12 GC members choose to send to represent them at the meeting are always allow in regardless of how many representatives arrive at Adyar for the meeting. Want proof of this. Brazil's General Secretary was present but Ricardo Lindemann was allowed to sit in and was allowed to speak often-so was Erica Georgiades. Why were they allowed into the meeting last December and others with better legitimate reasons to be there were denied entrance? TS President could have allowed the GC representatives from other countries with better reasons to attend the meeting to be there, but she did not! Why? It was not in her best interests/agenda; or maybe I should say the agenda of her 12 GC members personally elected by her; whoever it is that is running TS these days.

n) What does that suggest? TS archaic by-laws need a thorough review and re-structuration.

o) Hum...Think of it...Was it that what the "DRAFT" thought out by TSA National President and other courageous TS Section leaders were about? Yes!!

p) What happened when TSA National President sent it to Adyar for it their consideration and later be present it to TS members once it has been reviewed, and final copy was ready for distribution? It was leaked?

q) Why? It was in the best interests of some ones personal interests and agenda.

r) What do this entire means? Changes need to be made.

s) Is it fair to say ES is responsible for this? NOOOO!!!

t) But why not, Janeth? Because of the freedom each GC member has to make decisions!!

u) But I do not understand their decision making/reasoning behind, Janeth? Well..., let us see...Do we know the ins and outs of what makes each GC member thick? NOOOO!!

v) Oh.., what can we do to help prevent under-qualified individuals from occupying significant positions in our beloved TS, Janeth? Well..., let me see.., maybe doing a thorough investigation as to what their background is? TS members taking responsibility and inform themselves of what their own particular TS Section leader is doing and help him/her do the best job he/she is capable of? Oh.., but what if he/she is not doing a good job, Janeth? Well, Section TS members could ask for his/her resignation, right? Oh.., but what if he/she does not want to resign, Janeth? Well.., we better make sure there is a provision in the by-laws to make an incompetent and/or under-qualified TS Section leader leave office!! Mind you, having a bunch of vulturine out there making noise is no grounds to wish a TS Section leader gone, let alone ask for his/her resignation. Only evil people would do that.

Oh Lord, please help me understand…This poor thing, Janeth, has been trying, and trying and trying to explain, and explain over and over again, and I still do not get it…Gee, what’s wrong we me? Am I being selfish? Is it that I have forgotten the basics of Theosophy? Please help me Lord!! I do want to understand!! Or do I, really? Or am I being stubborn? Blind, perhaps? Deaf? Oh no, please, Lord, Ain’t want to be like that!! Or end up like that!! I better read all the postings on these and think global!! I must understand this is not about me!! I must understand this is about what is in the best interests of the Society at all!! I better pull out my hand packet version of ATFOTM from my packet/purse, find a quiet place, read it again, and again, meditate on it every day and understand that this is about others and not about what I want!! Thank you Lord!!

[Anand Gholap]

Dear Janeth,
You wrote interesting points in the above message. I don't understand why President is allowed to select (12 or whatever) members on the General Council. In important decisions, even one vote can change the resolutions passed. It seems consistent with democratic principles to have only elected members on the GC.
Do we have in US congress people selected by the American President? No.
I also think it strange to have GC meeting on Christmas holidays. Who is in the mood of doing serious business that time, and when there are so many other functions going on due to convention? The reason GC meeting is held that time could be that GC members will not have to travel twice, once for convention and once for GC meeting.
May be GC members should form a group like ning or yahoo, discuss online and send their votes by post.

[christinaleestemaker]

you know if you read well .General council, like there need to be a council?
Not at all I think.

Especially not if they do not represent voices from all members.