Occult Effects of Alcohol, Drugs, and Tobacco.

[Alex Patapenka]

I would like to bring this subject for a discussion at this community and see what your take on it is. What do you think are common misconceptions about the use of them, their impact on our development and our attitude.

The use of drugs takes its place as a companion of alcohol when the spiritual development of man is considered. Exploring the widespread use of drugs in society today, we find that the need for their use revolves around three factors: 1) the relief of pain; 2) boredom; and 3) the hope of experiencing spiritual revelation.

For too many of today's youth it is a time of trial and error, a period of blind growth. Drugs offer a way out, but as time wilt reveal, it will be the wrong way. Being hallucinatory, they do not bring about the desired results; instead, they put the aspirant in danger of being controlled by undesirable spirits, of undermining the physical body, and of exposing himself to extremely harmful effects on his spiritual bodies. Any damage to these vehicles may require many lifetimes to restore them to the adaptability they originally had. This means a decided setback in evolution. A person, therefore, who made much progress in former embodiments could lose the value of previous hard work by seriously affecting the present life instruments.

What do you think the effects of alcohol, drugs and tobacco use in our present life will result in our future incarnations?

Please don't be shy, speak up.

[Scott Sands]

I'm not sure I understand what any of the preceeding had to do with the subject at hand.

My take on drugs and spirituality is that it might help, in a way, to a degree. The visualization I use to understand what drugs do to ones perspective is similar to that of a fat magnifying glass. I think in the center point in magnifies greatly, possibly elevating ones senses to a higher realm. But from the center out everything is distorted. It depends if one stays focused and in the center while on drugs. I don't think this is often the case, but occasional insights may be gleened as we pass thru the center.

In my own experience, I may come across what seems like a fantastic insight, and I will take notes on such. However when I review my notes when sober the insight seems either obscure or down right ridiculous. I don't know if my mind in a 'higher' state had truly grabbed on something profound and in a lower state I am just unable to comprehend it or if it was all smoke and mirrors in the first place. I personally don't place much relevance on such insights unless I can make something out of them in a sober state.

There is also the matter of rationing of a drug. Excess of anything is too much in my book and it is no longer a 'vision quest' when abused. It's easy to continue and rationalize without making any true progress along these lines.

As far as how it affects us in present and latter lives. I have only heard that alcohol is bad for the astral body. I don't remember the details on it. And I can't imagine any drug being benificial for any of the bodies in any amount. The only effect I could imagine drugs would have on a latter life is a predisposition to use them in the same way and possible karma for an addiction which may need to be overcome for lesson.

[Konstantin Zaitzev]

> effects of alcohol, drugs and tobacco use in our present life will result in our future incarnations?

I think no (except in a sense of making karma). They affect bodies of our personality, not the higher self. The mechanism of their influence was explained in "The Inner Life" by Leadbeater.

[Jeff Zolkes]

very insightful Konstantin, I wholeheartedly agree

[Mark Newbold]

I do not indulge myself, coffee and tea are my drugs of preference. Edgar Cayce said "moderate" use of natural unadulterated tobacco is ok, consider however he was a smoker all his life and a son of Kentucky tobacco farmers. Rudolf Steiner said alcohol "disorganizes" the ego (higher self) and stopped drinking wine in his early adulthood, yet was a snuff user most of his adult life. HPB certainly loved tobacco and possibly hashish but loathed alcohol. Manly P. Hall loved sweet cordials & creme de menthe. I have spoken to witnesses that Krishnaji did not turn down a good gin & tonic on occasion in hot weather. Swedenborg indulged in very sweet strong coffee as part of his primary diet. Mr. Gurdjieff used alcohol as a teaching device to see how people were without their social masks while tipsy or intoxicated and he certainly indulged in vast quantities of booze. Ram Dass reports in his book, "Miracle of Love", Neem Karoli Baba gobbling down a hand full of LSD 25 tabs without ill effect. He did pretend to be tripping only to play with Ram Dass's head.

It appears the descendants of these teachers are more puritanicial than their progenitors. Hmmmm? Israel Regardie was probably right to insist on "rolling away the stone."

[Janeth]

>"..HPB certainly loved tobacco.."<--Madame H.P. B. did not love tobacco. Due to her circumstances at the time her using tobacco served a valid and important purpose.

>"..and possibly hashish"<--Not a chance!!

[christinaleestemaker]

Right Martin and by the way if the fruittrees are infected by too many insects, one chainsmoker under it takes that illness away.

Same they use incense in the churches, to neutalize all negativity from the folk.

[Jeff Zolkes]

lol

[Mark Newbold]

If I may briefly continue, the 3 factors Alex refers to, they reflect the ennui & angst of modern life and are primary motivators for young people toward experimentation. Thankfully tobacco fixation is slowly evolving out of favor in Western culture due to social & health factors for the most part.

My youthful experiences with LSD and Magick Mushrooms served but one purpose, to confirm for me the truth & existence of alternate realities. I enjoyed the scenery and have no desire to revisit these astral landscapes- once was enough for me.

[Janeth]

It is common knowledge among students of esoterism that the purpose behind Madame H.P.B.'s use of tobacco would be understood only by human beings who know best and are capable of understanding the level at which highly evolved souls function.

This brings to mind what Alcione shared with human beings on ATFOTM (At The Feet Of The Master), I believe it says something like ‘there is only two kinds of people in the world, those who know and those who do not know’. I strongly believe that, at times, Unfortunately, those who do not know are the ones to make the most noise and mental and emotional and spiritual harm and those who really know keep quiet, most particularly when it involves the character and reputation of other human beings.

Some where I have read something like ‘if you have something good to say about someone, say it. Otherwise, unless you are absolutely sure what you are going to say is true and good, do not say it’.

In the interest of new members and visitors who are truly making an effort to walk in the Right Path, there are two very important and inspirational blogs recently posted by two of the most generous and altruistic members TC is privileged to have, Christina and Odin. Their blogs are: "Altruïsm" - Posted by christinaleestemaker on September 6, 2009 at 9:00am, and "Future Seeing" - • Posted by Odin Townley on September 15, 2009 at 12:59am <-- Comment by Odin Townley on September 16, 2009 at 7:23pm. I believe reading about altruism and its importance in helping make the world a better place is something we can all benefit from.

[Jack Donaldson]

Janeth said; "Some where I have read something like ‘if you have something good to say about someone, say it. Otherwise, unless you are absolutely sure what you are going to say is true and good, do not say it’."

You forgot Socrate's rule of three. Is it true, is it good, no? you may still continue if you pass the third rule, is it useful? Personally, I think it is worse than 'not useful' in that she was very useful and still is through what she presented to humanity.

I think it was very useful for the US government to give out free cigarettes to my father, and many people like him during WWII. It was an aid toward calming men within the horrors of war. Now, it is expensive to care for people who suffer from effects of smoking. So now it is useful for the government to eliminate the use of tobacco.

The mind of man seeks unconsciousness when presented with too much sensory input, or conceptual antagonisms, and especially if solutions are not apparent. This is where I approach instinct and intuition, I wonder how separate one is from the other. I'll leave the last sentence for a moment to suggest that many Americans have patterns of behaviour or habits, and a remark by the apostle Paul made concerning pride. He said something along the line that if he must boast, then he would exalt his infirmities. I take this as a direction to focus awareness on each event in which a habitual activity is occurring. Do not do it automatically, unconsciously, be aware every single time it is carried out. Why? It is the transmutation of a toxin into an elixor. Embarassment, shame, are useless emotions, but awareness of a behaviour pattern which might suit the person better if eliminated, can best be accomplished by the conscious person, not the person carrying out this behaviour automatically.

I think instinct and intuition will not be mentioned further. My amount of writing has already went beyond most attention spans.

[Odin Townley]

Dear Alex,

I don't think tobacco really falls into the same category as alcohol and drugs. HPB admittedly smoked tobacco like a chimney.

The "addiction" to tobacco (or anything even thoughts and emotion that puts us out of control) may be imagined as a minor "setback" for her IF her object had been personal development. Likewise eating meat. But her sole aim seemed to be focused on her Master's orders, and in getting Theosophy pure and simple into the world consciousness.

But HPB did comment on drugs (and meat eating) in The Key to Theosophy, and had this to say (BTW she also ate meat):

"After all is said and done, the purely bodily actions and functions are of far less importance than what a man thinks and feels, what desires he encourages in his mind, and allows to take root and grow there.

ENQUIRER. Then with regard to the use of wine and spirits, I suppose you do not advise people to drink them?

HPB. They are worse for his moral and spiritual growth than meat, for alcohol in all its forms has a direct, marked, and very deleterious influence on man's psychic condition. Wine and spirit drinking is only less destructive to the development of the inner powers, than the habitual use of hashish, opium, and similar drugs.

An important article by HPB which explains the difference between the psychic and spiritual states is worth reading when you have time:

Psychic & Noetic Action

Also, HPB (I usually quote her because she was the original messenger, instead of latter day students who learned what they know from her and because of her - why not go to the source?) -- said many times in different ways that "Real Theosophy is Altruism." If one is to be addicted to something it might as well be to helping others and nature...

“For real Theosophy IS ALTRUISM, and we cannot repeat it too often. It is brotherly love, mutual help, unswerving devotion to Truth. If once men do but realize that in these alone can true happiness be found, and never in wealth, possessions, or any selfish gratification, then the dark clouds will roll away, and a new humanity will be born upon earth.

“Then, the GOLDEN AGE will be there, indeed. But if not, then the storm will burst, and our boasted western civilization and enlightenment will sink in such a sea of horror that its parallel History has never yet recorded.” -H. P. Blavatsky (Our Cycle & the Next)

Recommend also two Theosophy Watch posts where this is considered in detail:

Spirit Matters

Everyday One

[Odin Townley]

Alex, sorry - here's the link to the article:

Psychic and Noetic Action